tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post9082199258042125254..comments2024-03-28T14:37:45.575-04:00Comments on 5 Acres & A Dream: Defining SustainabliltyLeighhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02435811789823712254noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-25898046028890350442015-04-12T18:00:32.842-04:002015-04-12T18:00:32.842-04:00Sometimes I just make up my own terms. Or use then...Sometimes I just make up my own terms. Or use then my own way because there IS in fact half the world that is not on the same page as the corrupted use of the term, and I appeal to that half. :)Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16628726767751963219noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-56419284819233954652015-04-08T05:51:11.080-04:002015-04-08T05:51:11.080-04:00Rosalyn, I think giving back more than we take fro...Rosalyn, I think giving back more than we take from the earth is the only way we're going to keep it healthy and productive. <br /><br />I think I mentioned earlier in the comments that when we first started using the term self-sufficient, it was in the context of community living, i.e. the old hippy communes! Dan and I have often wished for a group of folks with similar goals and values. Finding such a group would be ideal, but I'm going to say near impossible, at least that's the case in our area. It only takes one person to undermine a group, either deliberately or simply because of a conflict of ideals, ways, means, etc. I sincerely hope you find such a network!Leighhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02435811789823712254noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-90137154362174260412015-04-05T15:31:06.514-04:002015-04-05T15:31:06.514-04:00Leigh, I really enjoyed this post but didn't i...Leigh, I really enjoyed this post but didn't initially comment on it because I needed to think about it and gather my own thoughts on the subject. I agree with the way these terms are used, such that really, they are often rendered useless. After some reflection, I wrote a post about my thoughts today and basically, I think I can sum them up by saying that were I to define the sustainability that I would like to live, I would be referring to a lifestyle in which we give back to our earth as much as (or more than) we take from it. I think this is what I would term sustainable. Am I not only refraining from using up all the resources I have at my disposal, but enriching the world around me?<br /><br />As for self-sufficiency, I know that we will never be truly self-sufficient. But I discovered that I wouldn't want to be--I want to be a part of a like-minded network, supporting the strengths of others while sharing my own. I'd like to be a part of a sustainable community that finds sufficiency in the network at its core. :)Rosalynhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07594397183233004323noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-40975789247132872922015-04-03T12:02:59.129-04:002015-04-03T12:02:59.129-04:00Rose, what you're talking about is one of the ...Rose, what you're talking about is one of the things I meant when I said I don't like being manipulated with words and why understanding what the speaker/writer means is so important. <br /><br />"Sustainability" by big government and big business is all about profit and control. That's pretty obvious to anyone who takes the time to look at what's being said versus what's being done. Unfortunately too many hear or read the terms but assume they mean something good for the people or good for the earth. National Geographic had an article a number of years ago about how moving everyone into urban areas will save the world. I had never read anything so blatantly illogical and idiotic in my life. But isn't this how folks are herded? By giving them magazine and newspaper articles, movies and documentaries to mentally prep them? I'm thinking of the old "you can't cook a frog by tossing it into boiling water but you can cook it by slowly turning up the heat." Unfortunately, it doesn't seem to matter whom we vote in office, the agenda pushes forward anyway.Leighhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02435811789823712254noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-24915946537671739112015-04-03T11:29:48.172-04:002015-04-03T11:29:48.172-04:00I have a different take on the word sustainability...I have a different take on the word sustainability and what it means in today's world. You are free to call me a conspiracy theorist, but if you do your research, you will come to realize what is really going on, especially in CA right now with the water restrictions.The water control is so bad, hundreds of farmers have been forced out of their livelihood, and Northern CA and Southern OR want to become their own state of Jefferson so they have say and control of what happens to them. Rosa Koire is well respected and has good information on the web about sustainability and what is happening in your city and county governments who are changing all their rules (redevelopment)to conform with the new state sustainability regulations, and of course, to retain the flow of money. Also, www.democratsagainstunagenda21.com is a good website for information. <br />There are many other websites out there that explain it and Tom DeWeese has some great videos. The Venus Project (circular cities) is designed to get people out of the rural areas and suburbs and into cities. The words all sound good,because of course, who wouldn't want to be sustainable, and it is a play on your emotions of protecting the environment, but it is about controlling YOU and restricting your rights. WA state now has the nations first "community forest" managed by the state, of course. I know this may not be published, and there are many out there who will disagree. It is easy to just keep plugging along in our day to day life and ignore what is really happening all around us (sheeple), which is (sustainability)the elimination and restriction of your freedoms, rights, and land use.Rosehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16924988248364848607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-49844813938347218152015-04-01T20:04:56.747-04:002015-04-01T20:04:56.747-04:00Su Ba, thanks! Yes, there have been some great res...Su Ba, thanks! Yes, there have been some great responses and input. :)<br /><br />Harry, that's exactly how I think of it. <br /><br />Karen, I actually have a link to that post in my "Homesteading Viewpoints" link list in the sidebar. :) Excellent example with the word "awful". What an easy way to misunderstand someone! I agree with e-communication. The abbreviations are a language all of their own. <br /><br />Sandra, I definitely agree with you (and Karen) about the deterioration of language. Language is something that truly sets us apart from all other species. Animals communicate, but not is such a sophisticated manner. We almost seem to be going backward.<br /><br />Mark, well, you and De are not alone. One time when I didn't know who some pop star was, I was asked, "Whatsa matter, you live under a rock?" I replied, "Not under <i>that</i> rock anyway." Leighhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02435811789823712254noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-12047614982033235842015-04-01T19:27:33.015-04:002015-04-01T19:27:33.015-04:00Hi Leigh. Your excellent post touched on a couple...Hi Leigh. Your excellent post touched on a couple of complications to communication that I find to be as challenging as definitions: Intentions and 'pop culture' references. As you noted, much of the intent of advertizing and political communication is not to clarify but to confuse and deceive. While this is a sad thing, most of us have come to expect deceptive communication from advertisers and politicians. We know to take what is heard with 'a grain of salt'. Sadder yet is that much of "popular society" is so saturated with "political correctness" and social agendas that to really comprehend one must not only understand definitions but must also have some a priori knowledge of the communicator's intent. <br /><br />The other thing I struggle with is the ubiquitous references to 'pop culture'. De and I have essentially given up on TV and most movies being created these days and I find myself increasingly "out of touch". With so much of our society saturated with TV, music, entertainers, and movies, some words and quotes take on specific meanings that can only be properly understood by knowing the popular culture reference associated with them. I get that we all communicate via common cultural references, but I find it a bit sad that so many of our current commonalities revolve around fictional characters and situations whose primary purpose is push the already pitiful cultural boundaries of decency and morality.Markhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08343134852881572900noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-27331034605816661942015-04-01T18:17:39.009-04:002015-04-01T18:17:39.009-04:00Oh lawz. I do identify with this post. I know lang...Oh lawz. I do identify with this post. I know language "evolves" but it can also de-evolve...meaning what comes out isn't necessarily better or even good. Then you have those "kind souls" (although I spelled it soles...interesting...) who tell me, "You sound so stuck-up when you talk."<br />If I were to tell them, "You sound so dumb when you talk" do you think they'd become angry?<br />Yeah. I thought so too.<br />LOL<br />Karen, On the banks of Salt Creek had it right...dumbing down.Thistle Cove Farmhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15722295191884810953noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-86201525002968327072015-04-01T17:52:19.892-04:002015-04-01T17:52:19.892-04:00I think you would enjoy this post:
http://www.gran...I think you would enjoy this post:<br />http://www.granny-miller.com/survivalist-prepper-or-housewife/<br /><br />I find the evolution of words to be interesting. I think the English language is being simplified which can be good but can also be dumbing down of our vocabulary. Sometimes the original meaning is nothing like what it as evolved to. Take the work "awful".Originally it meant full of awe and now it means something bad. I don't think all these abbreviations used with electronic devices is a good thing. Karen@ onthebanksofsaltcreek.comhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10939656531839491575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-22323978989324298292015-04-01T14:24:42.558-04:002015-04-01T14:24:42.558-04:00I think of sustainability as meaning that you can ...I think of sustainability as meaning that you can maintain the system you have evolved indefinitely with the resources at hand.Harry Flashmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05071021900005041592noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-20816382896331130742015-04-01T01:53:07.491-04:002015-04-01T01:53:07.491-04:00Good post, Leigh. I'm going to forward the lin...Good post, Leigh. I'm going to forward the link to our community garden volunteers because they are constantly debating what the various terms mean, like self sufficient, farming, organic, natural, etc. Besides your post the comments have some great viewpoints too. I'm really enjoying the discussion! Su Bahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09125127467859054156noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-31352714503634772282015-03-31T21:51:04.858-04:002015-03-31T21:51:04.858-04:00Deb, I'm with you on that toilet paper, LOL. &...Deb, I'm with you on that toilet paper, LOL. "Trying to be as self sufficient as possible" is exactly what I like to say because I think it states the goal but acknowledges that at some levels it's neither realistic nor possible. That doesn't mean we can't try, however.<br /><br />Stephanie, thanks! Yes, I did take care to spend time defining the terms I was using in my book. I thought that was important. I agree with what you're saying, both in terms of misunderstanding and in overuse of many words. I think if we would all try to understand what others truly mean by the words they use, we'd all come a long way toward respecting one another. <br /><br />Lynda, what timing, eh? Advertising is one of the worst!<br /><br />Fiona, thank you! "Homesteading" is a good example of word evolution. I'm not even sure how it came to change meaning like it has, but it certainly did. It's tough keeping up with the trends, though, isn't it?<br /><br />Chris, excellent point about industrialism. I think that's at the root of the protest against becoming self-sufficient, or self-sustaining, or whatever. Industry requires us to buy it's wares to keep it thriving. If we don't need them anymore, then they're down the tubes! Of course, I'm probably just as outdated as you are, so I'm willing to let folks use words as seems best to them. :)<br /><br />Barb, amen. Yes, the bottom line is the land, and if we don't love it we end up abusing it. I worry of that constantly, always trying to keep that balance that keeps it healthy and thriving. Very interesting about your son's assignment. Sounds like something everyone should do. Leighhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02435811789823712254noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-79958613001086117042015-03-31T19:17:36.519-04:002015-03-31T19:17:36.519-04:00The human need for labels and definition is the ve...The human need for labels and definition is the very one that divides humanity. I don't define myself. People try to define us as "way out" because I mow my lawn with sheep and I don't spray for ticks, I remove their habitat and hosts. I depend upon my land for my physical well being and my emotional one as well. While the land was tucked in tightly under the ice cap, I was so sad. I missed it. The smells. The sounds of my water. The gentle nickering of my goats. The not-so-affectionate kick in the knee from grain-loving bossy sheep. <br /><br />Having just been to a NOFA (Northeastern Organic Farmers Assn.) conference and seeing what the other people who depend on the land look like, I am not like them, either. I don't strive to provide for others. I provide for my family and friends. Period. My mother said once that I am not a farmer. She was right. I am not bringing things to market. I live on and off of the land. I live for the land. I also think it is safe to say that I could not live without some. I tried it once. I was lost. The notion once described as Sustainability has just become another tag line. Another marketing gimmick. <br /><br />Free range chickens. Anyone who ever had or has chickens knows that they stay where the food and the flock is. You make it plentiful inside, that's where they will stay. To get that organic label, the door just has to be open. I'd rather have a bird whose insides were cleaned by my own hand and whose end was thoughtfully and carefully wrought. My kids eat meatless meals not because we are vegetarian, but because somewhere, somebody had to kill something to make that meat. <br /><br />What more of us who love the land are doing is being careful about how MUCH we put on the land and what we are asking of it. My 9th grader had to calculate how much land it took to keep him alive for a year given the types of food he consumed in an average week. He was stunned. So was I. He said, "I understand why you like to grow food in a jungle. It uses less land." One small victory within the walls of my own home. Land lovers of the world unite!Farmer Barbhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07596672416236302171noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-76282989969424571632015-03-31T18:52:01.475-04:002015-03-31T18:52:01.475-04:00I'm constantly being corrected on my "wor...I'm constantly being corrected on my "words" by my teenager, and occasionally by my husband. It's not meant to be an insult, they're just trying to get me to join the 21st century on social media lingo - or what my husband calls the "Zeitgeist".<br /><br />Yeah, look that word up, lol.<br /><br />I happily say, keep me ignorant please because I'm not interested in adopting another language based on popularity. If the words cannot stand on definition alone, rather they have to be translated through social trends, then I'll keep my grey matter exercised somewhere else.<br /><br />That's not an insult to my family, they just know I think on a slightly different (perhaps outdated) wavelength. And that's okay with me. ;)<br /><br />Permaculture could be considered a "popular" term but the reason I don't disregard it is, the definition can be easily understood - permanent agriculture (permaculture). I'm okay if people just want to call it, what my grandparents used to do. It falls within the same field of reference, so long as it regards the natural cycles of production.<br /><br />I think where we get confused with self-sufficient is, we look at it with industrial goggles on. If one is to be "self" sufficient, it doesn't mean the totality of the exercise, pushed to maximum yields. It means what the "self" is able to suffice. Which means it will change with the circumstances. <br /><br />Industrialism won't self-regulate like a person can. Ergo, I think we have to treat the word "self-sufficient" as something with billions of different meanings, as many as there are people in the world. Chris https://www.blogger.com/profile/13715819899708384147noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-75594939030171891972015-03-31T15:51:47.960-04:002015-03-31T15:51:47.960-04:00Outstanding post! Ralph and I had never labeled ou...Outstanding post! Ralph and I had never labeled ourselves. We just consider our desire to have a small farm and grow our own food ..well...normal. Then we found out we are considered homesteaders. My idea of a homesteader is a pioneer who took raw land and turned it into a home...hence HOMEstead. Now everything has to be labeled correctly and re-labeled often to keep up with style or trends. I really enjoyed your research into the meaning of these trending words so often used!Fionahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05348495575211204989noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-30943441060517584222015-03-31T15:19:51.679-04:002015-03-31T15:19:51.679-04:00I dare not write anything LOL. My daily morning r...I dare not write anything LOL. My daily morning radio program is running a series whereby a marketing guru tells us all how we are being manipulated in advertising. This use of words that imply health and well-being was the topic yesterday. Its an eye opener. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12605358521258969537noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-21880576394935433252015-03-31T15:18:47.802-04:002015-03-31T15:18:47.802-04:00Fabulous post Leigh! Goes back to a section in yo...Fabulous post Leigh! Goes back to a section in your book, if I remember right?<br />I think in some respects, no matter what word someone uses to define what they are doing, there is going to be some misunderstanding from someone else for the simple fact that we all have different life experiences, therefore we all see that same word as meaning something else as an individual.<br />I agree that "popular" words and phrases are over used. I try to only use words that mean something to me personally. I really enjoyed this post! And it sparked an idea for one on my own blog. Thanks for always sharing.<br /><br />http://batemanhomestead.weebly.comBateman Homesteadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13079969516047805928noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-78996743121154638602015-03-31T14:39:44.691-04:002015-03-31T14:39:44.691-04:00I agree that many words lose their original meanin...I agree that many words lose their original meaning over time. Or there is a new trendy one to take it's place. I describe what we are aiming for as Trying to be as self sufficient as possible. As long as I have a couple of dollars I WILL have toilet paper.DFWhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18345712839702427280noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-78003411261355970332015-03-31T14:26:16.436-04:002015-03-31T14:26:16.436-04:00Erika, you sound like us! Maybe labels really aren...Erika, you sound like us! Maybe labels really aren't all that necessary. :)<br /><br />Homestead Lady, excellent definition! I so agree about leaving the land better than how we found it. That's one of our primary goals on our homestead.<br /><br />Kat, rants welcome! It's truly a shame that some folks want to nail labels down onto restrictive little boxes and then keep others confined to them. That's why I'm so fond of saying that there is no one-size-fits-all method of doing this. Leighhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02435811789823712254noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-67106621252984373592015-03-31T14:10:12.896-04:002015-03-31T14:10:12.896-04:00Labels really tend to skeeve me out--for one thing...Labels really tend to skeeve me out--for one thing I think putting folks or trends or dog breeds into a box means the viewer can't ever see the real person/trend/dog. For another thing, or perhaps just an expansion or furtherance of the first thing, labels lead to zealotry, and I find zealotry very scary.<br />If I say I like permaculture, then the first time I do something outside the permaculture box I'm likely to be thought of as a poor permaculturist. To be a good permaculturist, I can never waver from the ideals, even if those ideals do not perfectly suit my reality. Therefore, I must be an all-in permaculturist, or a bad permaculturist. And while I love permaculture, and incorporate as much as I can, I can't think of anything more boring than a 24-7 permaculture-only mindset.<br />I think our need to put labels on things has led to a lot of the problems we have in government. You have to either be a democrat or a republican. Otherwise, you're weird and don't count. Why can't I just push for the best leadership for our country? Zealotry in any direction leads to bad things, and I really think it starts with the label.<br />Sorry to rant, but this has been on my mind and close to my heart the past few days. Kathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18207121540248325766noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-13506319901411256192015-03-31T13:53:49.644-04:002015-03-31T13:53:49.644-04:00When we/I use the term it means this. "Living...When we/I use the term it means this. "Living sustainably is about living within the means of our natural systems (environment) and ensuring that our lifestyle doesn’t harm other people (society and culture)." We try to think of the next generation and want to leave our little piece of land better than we found it :o)<br /><br />Quote Taken from here: http://www.landlearnnsw.org.au/sustainability/what-is-sustainabilityThe Homestead Ladyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17111680238499268430noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-42643855701754952422015-03-31T09:48:22.535-04:002015-03-31T09:48:22.535-04:00Beautifully written and sums up why it is hard to ...Beautifully written and sums up why it is hard to "label" what we are trying to do. We've been on our new property 2 1/2 years and are still trying to name it!Erika kellerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02086673285608786783noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-65016217403156721052015-03-31T08:55:17.847-04:002015-03-31T08:55:17.847-04:00Goodwife, I had to laugh about the toboggan becaus...Goodwife, I had to laugh about the toboggan because Dan and I had the exact same experience! It's funny though, because even though society supposedly embraces diversity of culture, we seem to confine our use of words and their meanings quite severely. How many arguments have broken out because of differences in interpretation of words?! Have to agree about labels, I don't like them either, which is why I tend to write posts like this.<br /><br />Mama Pea, I think you are pointing to something very important. It seems to me that conversation and communication are truly lost arts. One stumbling block I see is that folks tend to personalize too much and therefore take offense at something that really has nothing to do with them. I lament that we've dropped the usage of "one" as a pronoun. Using "you" as a generic term lends itself to that personalization and more miscommunication. True conversation is truly an art, and that isn't taught any more. It used to be a highly refined form of entertainment, but we've become so isolated in entertainment nowadays. Except for team sports, what's so sociable about video games? Respect for others has been replaced with "self-esteem". And on and on. In other words, I agree with you!Leighhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02435811789823712254noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-53869355325152970292015-03-31T08:22:24.343-04:002015-03-31T08:22:24.343-04:00As usual, Leigh, a very well-written and thought-p...As usual, Leigh, a very well-written and thought-provoking post. Perhaps I'm feeling jaded this morning, but true communication seems to be sadly lacking these days whether it be between individuals or countries. Is it just semantics or man's inability to be rational, caring and kind? I don't mean this comment to come across as doom-and-gloom, but I don't know if any word (or phrase) will ever mean the same to anyone who reads or speaks it. (Did my muddled brain miss your point?)Mama Peahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03649357184167949247noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1694364001063554832.post-48449689168916575862015-03-31T08:15:06.346-04:002015-03-31T08:15:06.346-04:00I understand, and feel the same. I feel strongly ...I understand, and feel the same. I feel strongly about the use of the word farm, and although I have "Goodwife Farm" in my blog address, this isn't a farm. I grew up smack in the middle of farm country and come from farmers. To me farming is owning hundreds of acres of land that is put in corn and beans, wheat, and sometimes milo or oats. I always chuckle when I hear people refer to themselves as "farmers" because they raise a garden and have some chickens, but I don't judge. <br /><br />Words are powerful and they mean so many different things to so many different people. All we have to do is talk to someone from a different area....take for example when I moved down here someone asked me if I wore a toboggan when it's cold...??? I asked them why in the world would I wear a sled to keep warm? Where I'm from a toboggan is a sled, and a stocking hat is what you wear on your head to keep warm. A guy we work with is from Seattle and it's called a beanie where he's from.<br /><br />Anyway, I get what you are saying and I don't like to be defined by any type of label...we are God's children, trying to be good stewards of what He's given us, despite and in spite of what the rest of the world is doing! :)Mama Messhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09541998872594946053noreply@blogger.com